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Getting to a major slam over 1 NT What is your preferred approach - IMPs

Poll: How to get to slam (16 member(s) have cast votes)

How would you proceed after 1NT

  1. Jacoby Transfer followed by jump to 6 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. Deleted (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. Jacoby followed by 2nd suit etc (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  4. Gerber followed by slam decision (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. Texas Transfer followed by cue bid (7 votes [43.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 43.75%

  6. Texas followed by Blackwood (2 votes [12.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.50%

  7. Jacoby followed by slam try jump to 4H (2 votes [12.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.50%

  8. Other option (5 votes [31.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.25%

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#21 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 02:49

View Postpescetom, on 2019-June-17, 02:08, said:

Just a bit irrational, I think. You're much more likely to have a useful A or K to show than a singleton or void, which you can still show with a control bid anyway. This is your most economical way of fixing trumps and initiating slam investigation so it makes sense to exploit it fully.


It depends upon the rest off your methods, I think. If you play 1NT-3 as a natural slam invite, you don't need to go through Jacoby to initiate a cue-bidding sequence and 1NT-2, 2-4 as an auto-splinter makes sense (or even the real super old-fashioned meaning of 5-5 in the two suits).

But 1NT-3 is not played as natural as often these days - even in the UK - and you have to go through a transfer sequence to initiate cue-bidding, which means that the auto-splinter is lost and cue-bidding starts at a higher level. Such is the nature of progress!
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#22 User is online   johnu 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 03:29

View Postpescetom, on 2019-June-17, 02:08, said:

Just a bit irrational, I think. You're much more likely to have a useful A or K to show than a singleton or void, which you can still show with a control bid anyway. This is your most economical way of fixing trumps and initiating slam investigation so it makes sense to exploit it fully.

IMHO when responder has a 6+ card suit in the near slam range, having a good fit is more likely to get you to a good slam. The best way to do that is with a splinter so opener can evaluate how likely non trump honors are going to have full weight. I'm also not sure what opener is supposed to do with the knowledge that responder has an outside control. If you have controls in all 3 non trump suits, are you supposed to bid a slam? bid RKC? continue cue bidding even though you have no idea if you have wasted values opposite shortness?
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#23 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 07:03

View Postjohnu, on 2019-June-17, 03:29, said:

IMHO when responder has a 6+ card suit in the near slam range, having a good fit is more likely to get you to a good slam. The best way to do that is with a splinter so opener can evaluate how likely non trump honors are going to have full weight.

The more you know about fit the better it is, of course. Responder with a 4+card side suit would (in our methods, at least) have shown it as a game force after the Jacoby transfer. So if he is control-bidding directly he probably has a single suiter, which is more than 50% likely to have no singleton or void (see the hand of this thread as an example), whereas it will always have honour controls.

View Postjohnu, on 2019-June-17, 03:29, said:

I'm also not sure what opener is supposed to do with the knowledge that responder has an outside control. If you have controls in all 3 non trump suits, are you supposed to bid a slam? bid RKC? continue cue bidding even though you have no idea if you have wasted values opposite shortness?

A full reply would need a book, "Slam a tempo di cue bid" by Petroncini and Belladonna being a good start. I think you are quite capable of answering your own question about what knowledge of controls and fit is needed to bid a slam or when the probabilities do not justify bidding beyond a certain level of trumps. Yes, opener can RKC over the first control-bid of responder, although that would usually be a poor idea - continuing to control bid he will still find out about any missing trump honours and have a better chance of getting things right when partner has a void.
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#24 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 16:14

View Postpescetom, on 2019-June-17, 02:08, said:

Just a bit irrational, I think. You're much more likely to have a useful A or K to show than a singleton or void, which you can still show with a control bid anyway. This is your most economical way of fixing trumps and initiating slam investigation so it makes sense to exploit it fully.


Economical? Via a jump? LOL
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#25 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 16:18

Auto-splinters are part of Bridge World Standard, so I'm not sure I'd call them irrational. I'm with johnu, they're one of the best ways to get information out of opener, given you already have keycard, a general slam try with transfer then 4M, and cuebids after Texas.
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#26 User is offline   Stephen Tu 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 18:49

I thought new suit after Texas was exclusion.
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#27 User is offline   neilkaz 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 20:14

View PostStephen Tu, on 2019-June-17, 18:49, said:

I thought new suit after Texas was exclusion.

I believe that is what Meckwell play.
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#28 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2019-June-17, 20:28

View PostStephen Tu, on 2019-June-17, 18:49, said:

I thought new suit after Texas was exclusion.

I would find it more intuitive to play either
1N-2
2-5

or

1N-2
2-4
... 5

as exclusion, but I suppose that technically it doesn't matter.
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#29 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2019-June-18, 03:03

View PostStephen Tu, on 2019-June-17, 18:49, said:

I thought new suit after Texas was exclusion.


I hadn’t heard of this. I like it.
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#30 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2019-June-18, 06:37

View PostVampyr, on 2019-June-17, 16:14, said:

Economical? Via a jump? LOL


It's economical - you're still at upper 3-level or lower 4-level and you already fixed trumps, showed a single-suited shape, declared slam interest and showed a control. Many other people in this discussion have suggested to do the same thing but via a double jump, so a full level higher.
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#31 User is offline   thepossum 

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Posted 2019-June-18, 09:50

New suit after Texas was an Ace showing cue bid in system I was playing
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#32 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2019-June-18, 14:40

View Postpescetom, on 2019-June-18, 06:37, said:

It's economical - you're still at upper 3-level or lower 4-level and you already fixed trumps, showed a single-suited shape, declared slam interest and showed a control. Many other people in this discussion have suggested to do the same thing but via a double jump, so a full level higher.


If it works for you, great.
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#33 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2019-June-21, 15:40

View PostStephen Tu, on 2019-June-17, 18:49, said:

I thought new suit after Texas was exclusion.


View Postneilkaz, on 2019-June-17, 20:14, said:

I believe that is what Meckwell play.

It's what I would play if I could convince my partner to adopt it. :)

For me, Jacoby then jump is a splinter. Texas then new suit is (currently) "no agreed meaning".

You have a specific thing you need to know — whether partner has a diamond control. Using my methods, I would "splinter", expecting partner to show a diamond control if he has one, and if not to bid 4!H. If he bids 4!D, 4NT (or 4!S in the partnership where I play Kickback) is RKC if I want to double check. But I'd probably just bid 6!H over 4!D.
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#34 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2019-June-21, 16:57

What is the upside to Texas then a new suit being exclusion when, as Helene mentioned, Jacoby followed by exactly the same level of bid has no alternative to being exclusion?

Is it solely because you're wanting to avoid interference?
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#35 User is offline   Lovera 

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Posted 2019-June-23, 10:22

Once upon a time it was possible to explore the situation of honors in diamond suit and stop before being forced to risk (i.e.: 1NT-2 , 2 -4 (=?), 4 -5 (=?), 5 w / o King or 5NT with King)..
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